Myth Posted January 13, 2016 Share I am running around 20% sag on my fork and 25% sag on my shock on my RM Thunderbolt (120mm travel). The rear end feels planted, but I am finding that the front-end feels "floppy". I always thought its maybe due to the fact that it's a 32 Fox (and not a more stiff 34), and perhaps the relatively slack head angle. I would say typical riding with my trail bike is about 50% level, 25% climbing and 25% downhill. At the current 20% sag, the front end feels quite loose or floppy (?) in tight corners and when climbing. It feels OK on downhills when in trail setting of the Fox CTD, and very wobbly when in open setting. Would running less sag perhaps solve this, or is it really just a function of the (relatively) thin stansions? Why I'm asking, from my experience with my other (xc) bike, running low % sag (only about 10% on my xc bike) makes that bike,s front end feel planted and very nimble. Granted, the xc bike has less travel and as such the 32mm stansions may be OK for it, but not for the 120mm travel trail bike? Not sure if I'm making sense, but would like some opinions or advise on how to improve the front end feel on my trail bike. Thus the question, what's the typical %sag you guys run on your trail bike fork, and is the floppy/wobbly feeling normal on a fox CTD 120mm fork? Perhaps I need a better fork? Or perhaps I need to decrease the sag ( but then probably never use all the travel on the fork, which makes it also a bit pointless maybe?). PS the fork is still relatively new. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iwan Kemp Posted January 13, 2016 Share You'd need to run at east 25% on that bike and I'd say a hair more initially to get the Fox bedded. A Revelation or Pike will suit that bike better as it's a very capable trail bike and needs a fork that will be able to keep up On a side note: although its your preference and that's okay, running 10% sag on a fork will close to negate the benefit of suspension and will leave you with a fork that's not using close to full travel. May be better to set it to get full travel at least once or twice on a ride and then use CTD / Motion Control to reduce fork travel when pedaling away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlanD Posted January 13, 2016 Share You'd need to run at east 25% on that bike and I'd say a hair more initially to get the Fox bedded. A Revelation or Pike will suit that bike better as it's a very capable trail bike and needs a fork that will be able to keep up On a side note: although its your preference and that's okay, running 10% sag on a fork will close to negate the benefit of suspension and will leave you with a fork that's not using close to full travel. May be better to set it to get full travel at least once or twice on a ride and then use CTD / Motion Control to reduce fork travel when pedaling away.Would that be 25% both front and rear? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Fastbastard Mayhem Posted January 13, 2016 Share Iwan - if it's still the CTD, and it's a 32 non factory... They were (are) VERY well known to have fookall support in the open setting for Low Speed compression, which could be the floppiness you're referring to. You'd be very well served by upgrading to the 2016 fox FIT damper, which gets rid of all the issues and is a markedly better system. Otherwise you'll be forced to stay in Trail mode and fine tune from there, but that sacrifices some of the small bump sensitivity that you want in a trail bike. 20-25% sag is about right - Iwan's spot on in that a 10% sag level (unless you are Gwin or Minnaar due to the pure speed that they hit everything with) will be far too stiff for the bike to perform properly. In the end though - the Thunderbolt would really, really suit a stiffer chassis of either a Revelation or even better, a Pike. It's a beast of a bike, and could do with the stiffness. As for the floppiness in the climbs and corners - that's indeed strange. I'd be tempted to say that that is an issue with the hub interface being loose or the spokes being undertight rather than the fork being at 20-25% sag... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Fastbastard Mayhem Posted January 13, 2016 Share Would that be 25% both front and rear?slightly less sag in the front than the rear. 20-25% & 25-30% depending on trail & preference etc. At least, for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlanD Posted January 13, 2016 Share slightly less sag in the front than the rear. 20-25% & 25-30% depending on trail & preference etc. At least, for me.I had my front fox talas 26er fork at 120psi which really didn't match being 20-25% sag as i only weight about 79kgs. Now i run the front at 70-80psi or so which feels much better although small bump absorbtion isn't that great. The rear rp23 is at about 180psi which feels ok. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myth Posted January 13, 2016 Share Also, to put it into context, when I say it's floppy or wobbly, it is not so loose that it feels uncontrollable or defect, it just does not feel planted or predictable. I feel much more confident in going into corners at high speed with my xc bike, which doesn't make sense as it's got shorter bars and a longer stem. Could it perhaps be that the travel is not linear enough on the trail bike, thus it's not predictable how much the fork will dive, thus making it feel unstable? I don't know nearly enough about forks, so I'm basically just throwing random thoughts out as they come up... Iwan, excuse my ignorance/lack of knowledge, but what do you mean with "at least 25% sag to get the fox bedded"? What does the statement getting a fork bedded mean? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matchstix Posted January 13, 2016 Share Do you have the ride 9 on your bike? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myth Posted January 13, 2016 Share Do you have the ride 9 on your bike?Nope, I do not have a MSL version, just a standard Thunderbolt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
popcorn_skollie Posted January 13, 2016 Share I know exactly what you mean when you say planted. The sensation of railing a berm midstroke. probably love that more than jumping. Run more sag and see how it feels. Brake diving doesn't really bother me any more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JXV Posted January 13, 2016 Share I am running around 20% sag on my fork and 25% sag on my shock on my RM Thunderbolt (120mm travel). The rear end feels planted, but I am finding that the front-end feels "floppy". I always thought its maybe due to the fact that it's a 32 Fox (and not a more stiff 34), and perhaps the relatively slack head angle. I would say typical riding with my trail bike is about 50% level, 25% climbing and 25% downhill. At the current 20% sag, the front end feels quite loose or floppy (?) in tight corners and when climbing. It feels OK on downhills when in trail setting of the Fox CTD, and very wobbly when in open setting. Would running less sag perhaps solve this, or is it really just a function of the (relatively) thin stansions? Why I'm asking, from my experience with my other (xc) bike, running low % sag (only about 10% on my xc bike) makes that bike,s front end feel planted and very nimble. Granted, the xc bike has less travel and as such the 32mm stansions may be OK for it, but not for the 120mm travel trail bike? Not sure if I'm making sense, but would like some opinions or advise on how to improve the front end feel on my trail bike. Thus the question, what's the typical %sag you guys run on your trail bike fork, and is the floppy/wobbly feeling normal on a fox CTD 120mm fork? Perhaps I need a better fork? Or perhaps I need to decrease the sag ( but then probably never use all the travel on the fork, which makes it also a bit pointless maybe?). PS the fork is still relatively new.Seems to me you need slower rebound and stiffer damping. If the steering feels like it flops side to side on uphills and flats then thats not really the forks fault. Slack geometry and possibly incorrect fork offset for the frame. Did this fork come standard with the frame?. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myth Posted January 14, 2016 Share Seems to me you need slower rebound and stiffer damping. If the steering feels like it flops side to side on uphills and flats then thats not really the forks fault. Slack geometry and possibly incorrect fork offset for the frame. Did this fork come standard with the frame?.Yup, it's the one it came with... I will maybe turn the rebound a click or two slower and see how it goes.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
usxorf Posted January 14, 2016 Share Tire width and pressure can also affect handling, what do you have on your fiets? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
s14phoenix Posted January 14, 2016 Share I found that the fox CTD evo shock on the back of my Trance goes to 100% travel even off 1-2 foot drops and jumps. Now I dunno if that's normal but without making the rear hard it keeps doing that. Whether it is in decend or trail makes not much difference although trail is better.The front 32 Evolution and even my 32 Talas performance is like that too. not great in open and ok ish in trail. The Talas has the FIT system (abeit not the new fancy one) but most of those seem to do that. So Trail mode and pump it a bit harder... small bump gone but at least it does not blow through 100% travel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myth Posted January 14, 2016 Share Tire width and pressure can also affect handling, what do you have on your fiets?Running conti race king protection 2.2's front and rear at 1.7 and 1.8 bar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddy Gordo Posted January 14, 2016 Share I know what the op is talking about. The fork is ok, but it just doesnt seem to handle much of whats on the trail. It is either travelling too far or travelling too slow. It feels like you have no idea what to expect. I have the Fox34 CTD. Last year I upgraded the damper to the Fit4 and man what a huge improvement. I have a completely different fork with the upgrade. It is far more responsive and soaks up everything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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